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Did you know?
Introduction and rules
IntroductionWP:DYK
General discussionWT:DYK
GuidelinesWP:DYKCRIT
Reviewer instructionsWP:DYKRI
Nominations
Nominate an articleWP:DYKCNN
Awaiting approvalWP:DYKN
ApprovedWP:DYKNA
April 1 hooksWP:DYKAPRIL
Holding areaWP:SOHA
Preparation
Preps and queuesT:DYK/Q
Prepper instructionsWP:DYKPBI
Admin instructionsWP:DYKAI
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History
StatisticsWP:DYKSTATS
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Monthly wrapsWP:DYKW
AwardsWP:DYKAWARDS
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... by nominationsWP:DYKNC
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This is where the Did you know section on the main page, its policies, and its processes can be discussed.

DYK error rate[edit]

May 2024 errors[edit]

May error rate:

  • 93% error-free overall (18 errors / 276 hooks)
  • 95% error-free before MP (15 / 276)
May 2024 errors
Date Hook Error
May 5 that cosplaying as a character from the New California Republic (flag pictured) could potentially lead to accidental arrest due to mistaken suspicion of carrying a bomb? failed verification (report, queue fix)
May 7 that opera composer and librettist Joseph Redding (pictured) was also a chess polymath and lawyer who won a landmark decision before the United States Supreme Court? failed verification (report, MP fix)
May 7 that Kooraban National Park provides a habitat for more than twenty endangered animal species, including koalas? failed verification (report, MP fix)
May 7 that sisters Joanne, Lynette, Amy and Jenny McCarthy were all gymnasts and ten-pin bowlers? failed verification (report, MP fix)
May 7 that the production team of the TV series The Falcon and the Winter Soldier created a highway more than five miles (8 km) long to capture visual effects for a truck action sequence for the episode "The Star-Spangled Man"? hook didn't specify it was a "digital" highway (report, MP fix)
May 8 that even though about 100,000 bombs fell on Le Touquet during World War II, making it "the most mined city in France", it was the first resort in northern France to open its beaches after its liberation? failed verification (report, queue fix)
May 11 that when the Bukharian-Jewish Soviet newspaper Bajroqi Miⱨnat switched to the Latin script, it did not use capital letters, following Jewish writing rules? hook did not specify that it "initially" did not use capital letters (report, queue fix)
May 14 that William F. Fiedler was the only American fighter pilot to become a flying ace in the P-39 Airacobra? failed verification (report, MP fix)
May 15 that Oophaga solanensis frogs can be bought for $3 in their native Colombia and sold for up to $1,000 overseas? hook didn't convey illegality (report, MP fix)
May 17 that the comedian Jonny Pelham is one of only 200 people in the UK to suffer from popliteal pterygium syndrome? "only 200" failed verification and MEDRS (report, MP fix)
May 19 that winter wonderland fairs have become a celebrated annual British tradition – but often for the wrong reasons? "wrong reasons" not in article and not NPOV (report, MP fix)
May 21 that Spider began making alternative music because she felt that not enough Black women were doing so? link to set index article (report, MP fix)
May 22 that the U.S. Army Air Corps were so unimpressed by the Estoppey D-8 that one member stated that he would rather use "nails and a wire"? attributed one person's opinion to entire US Army Air Corps (report, MP fix)
May 24 that actress Nellie McCoy (pictured) suffered a mental breakdown after her theatre performance was criticized, leading to her being committed to a sanatorium? "after her theatre performance was criticized" not in article (report, not fixed)
May 24 that Axel Downard-Wilke (pictured) led a campaign in 2020 to have macrons used in Māori place names in Wikipedia articles? COI (report, MP fix)
May 24 that women were 33 percent more likely than men to search for clown pornography in 2016? "on Pornhub" not specified in hook fact (report, MP fix)
May 26 that during the "trial from hell" Matthew Charles Johnson and his co-accused hurled abuse at the judge and threw human excrement at a member of the jury? certain hook details failed verification; BLPvio (report, MP fix)
May 29 that Israel's systematic destruction of trees and farmland in Gaza has been described as an ecocide? "systematic" in wikivoice instead of attributed (report, MP fix)

June 2024 errors[edit]

June error rate (through June 29):

  • 92% error-free overall (19 errors / 255 hooks)
  • 94% error-free before MP (14 / 255)
June 2024 errors
Date Hook Error
June 4 that Barron Trump signed for D.C. United Academy as a midfielder? notability and BLP concerns (report, MP fix)
June 6 that despite "C U in da Ballpit" being Camping in Alaska's best known song, the band says they all hate it? "best known song" failed verification (report, MP fix)
June 8 that the Tang-dynasty politician Fang Yi'ai was put to death and his wife Princess Gaoyang was forced to commit suicide after their failed rebellion against Emperor Gaozong? "put to death" not in article; possibly unapproved/unverified hook promoted (report, MP fix)
June 9 that Carrie Swain was possibly the first woman entertainer to perform in blackface? "first" failed verification (report, MP fix)
June 10 that the ancient Greek game polis is one of the world's oldest strategy games? didn't specify "oldest known" (report, MP fix)
June 10 that dance teacher Mary Ann Wells, despite being in the "I AM" movement, did not enforce rigid technical standards on her students? Pulled for SYNTH (report, queue fix)
June 12 that Professor Layton and the New World of Steam is planned to be the first main entry since 2013 in the series Professor Layton, despite it being its developer's most popular media franchise? failed verification (report, queue fix)
June 13 that Arthur Fulton, his father and his son all won the Sovereign's Prize for rifle shooting? hook fact not clearly in article (report, queue fix)
June 15 Chinese characters DYK image image not in article (report, MP fix)
June 15 that although it was never built, Lynn Conway notes that IBM's ACS-1 would have been the premier supercomputer of the era? not a definite fact (report, MP fix)
June 17 that Zombie Plane cannot take flight from Chuck Norris? confusing; not a definite fact; WP:DYKFICTION (report, MP fix)
June 19 Amen break DYK image copyright (report, MP fix)
June 19 that Pizza Hut’s most expensive pizza was a weighted blanket? failed verification/unreliable source (report, MP fix)
June 20 Olympic Black Power Statue image copyright (no report, MP fix)
June 21 that the efforts of Cora Babbitt Johnson helped delay the construction of Mount Rushmore until 1927? failed verification (report, MP fix)
June 22 that Saleh Manaf was elected as the regent of Bekasi despite being a dummy candidate in the election? "dummy candidate" failed verification (report, queue fix)
June 30 that Hamad City in Gaza was largely destroyed within minutes? failed verification (report, MP fix)
June 30 that when Brighton Aquarium (entrance pictured) opened, it had no exhibits? failed verification (report, MP fix)
June 30 that the extant details about the life of Leontius of Autun can be summed up as "July 1: the burial of Leontius, bishop of Autun (Gaul), 5th century"? failed verification (report, queue fix)

July 2024 errors[edit]

Leontius of Autun was pulled out of the queue half an hour before the hook was to go live on 1 July. Do we count that? Schwede66 23:53, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Based on May and June, yes but as queue fix, not MP fix. TSventon (talk) 00:05, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Done Levivich (talk) 14:49, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Error rate discussion[edit]

Anyone should feel free to update the table. I didn't list everything that was at WP:ERRORS, e.g. I didn't list simple copyedits like changing "$" to "US$". Overall, 93% or 95% error-free ain't bad, but IMO given the visibility, it really should be 99%, i.e. less than one per week. It's not ideal to have to rely on people fixing things at WP:ERRORS multiple times per week. Levivich (talk) 20:57, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've always thought that if a hook ran for more than six hours and turned out to have a serious error, we should issue a retraction in the next set. A basic retraction policy underlies most honest sources of information, there's no reason we shouldn't have one as well – we're not like the rest of the project in that you can just edit stuff and it'll be fixed going forward, nothing is on the page for more than 24 hours. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 21:00, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
+1. Ironically, one of the ways that we judge whether a source is reliable is by looking at whether it prints retractions, yet we do not print retractions. I would go further and say that there ought to be a "retraction box" on the main page, where we post as retractions everything that ends up having to be fixed on the main page. In other words, every fix made at WP:ERRORS should be noted in the retraction box on the main page (not just DYK). I have a vague memory of this being discussed and rejected by the community at some point in the last 5 years or so but I don't remember where. Levivich (talk) 21:03, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I do like the idea of being transparent about errors, but it feels tricky. Maybe 'Corrections' instead of 'Retractions'; retraction seems like it should be for something possibly harmful that was factually incorrect. Like, I wouldn't want us to say we'd 'retracted' that Trump signed as a midfielder.
And really I'm not sure it's a fix to have Trump appear a second time at the MP with us noting the hook was pulled for the article being a BLP vio and questions being raised as to notability and we regret the error, that seems worse than the simple pull. Valereee (talk) 14:10, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Would a reader be more likely to encounter a retraction box at the bottom of the main page? Or at the talk page of the linked article? The second would be fairly easy to implement. Online, some newspapers don't offer anymore than a "published" and "corrected/updated" date on the article's page.[1] Rjjiii (talk) 13:59, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Valereee: I think we'd mainly want to use a corrections/retractions box for errors of the hooks; while we can and do pull hooks for article issues, we generally don't maintain a retractions log on articles. I was just thinking something more like:
  • In the second DYK set on June 8, 2024, it was claimed that Jane Doe invented the flywheel. However, multiple inventors have credible claims to the flywheel, some predating Doe by up to 20 years.
theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 15:55, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That would work for me Valereee (talk) 16:13, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Personally, I think there's different levels of error. A poorly worded hook that should be rephrased is bad, but not as bad as something being actively not in the source stated. Lots of those above seem to be that the hook is the thing that isn't covered by the citation - perhaps that is the thing to stress to both reviewers and set promoters - to check that the source being used explicitly states the info being written.
As much as the rest of the article is important, the hook itself is the only bit that is given such high visibility. Lee Vilenski (talk • contribs) 23:33, 8 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I object to the Spider error – WP:DYKG doesn't mention SIAs, because they're articles, not DABs. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 08:20, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
There was a reasonable argument at ERRRORs that perhaps that page should be marked as a disambiguation—Bagumba (talk) 08:37, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's not a perfect measure but I'm using "changed at WP:ERRORS" as basically the definition of "error." I think there's an argument to be made that this particular one might be a de minimis example, like changing "$" to "US$" or adding a wikilink to "George Washington" but I included it because I thought it fell into the category of "clearly against some DYK rule." I'm no expert about DYK rules so maybe that one isn't against any actual rule? Levivich (talk) 12:37, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The most concerning errors are the failed verification ones, sadly they seem the most common. Focusing on those would make the most difference both to quality and to the error rate. CMD (talk) 08:33, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I find the fact verification seems to be a chronic problem concerning, but for me the most concerning is BLP issues. Levivich, it looks like the May 8 Le Touquet hook was pulled before it hit the main page, is that an outlier in these tables? (That is, I'm seeing most of the reports at ERRORS were in Current DYK, which I'm assuming means most actually made it to the main page?) Valereee (talk) 12:02, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I included it because it was caught at WP:ERRORS and not by "internal" DYK error-correction processes. I think "next DYK" ERRORS should "count" as "DYK errors," e.g. something that DYK "missed." (It's true that most are current-DYK and not next-DYK, but isn't that a bug not a feature?) Levivich (talk) 12:09, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, I just wasn't clear on what the inclusion criteria were, and I do think we should be aiming for all errors to be caught before a set hits Next-but-one DYK. But it would also be interesting to understand how many errors actually made it onto the main page. The vagaries of transclusion and date stamps make my head spin...is there an easy way to note which errors were fixed after the hook moved onto the main page? Valereee (talk) 13:00, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
And IIRC some were flagged as next-DYK but fixed after it hit the main page (due to length of discussion); I think that's the only one that was fixed before it hit the main page, going from memory. That can be checked by looking whether the "fix" link is to the DYK template or a queue. Levivich (talk) 12:12, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Can you give the clueless an example? :D Er, one that even I can understand? Valereee (talk) 13:01, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes of course! Okay, so the "mouse" is that little plastic thing with buttons on it next to your keyboard that kind of looks like a mouse with no tail. Now when you move the mouse on your desk, it'll move the arrow on your screen, and if you hover over one of the links and press the left mouse button... :-D Just kidding, it's a good catch, I can update the list in two seconds later today when I get to a desktop and differentiate between fixed-at-current-DYK and fixed-at-next-DYK. Going from memory there is only one "next" and the rest are "current" but I'll double check and update the table to clarify this. Levivich (talk) 13:05, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
My mouse is wired, so kind of looks like it does have a tail...does that still count? Valereee (talk) 13:12, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
lol, somebody please get val a WMF tech grant for a wireless mouse. (On the other hand the tail might make it easier to find.) Levivich (talk) 13:21, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I found my TV remote in the fridge the other day. Valereee (talk) 13:36, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
"Tell me you're a stoner without telling me you're a stoner" 😂 Levivich (talk) 14:24, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh and to actually answer your question, if you click the "fix" link for the May 8 entry, it takes you to a diff of an edit to one of the queue templates; the other "fix" links go to a diff of the actual DYK template that's transcluded on the main page -- that's how we know those were live when the diff was made, whereas the queue template diff means it wasn't live yet (still in the queue). So ERRORS report + DYK template fix = fixed when it was already on the main page, while ERRORS report + queue template fix = not on main page yet. Levivich (talk) 13:09, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
OHHH. God, I can't even claim not enough coffee. Thanks! Valereee (talk) 13:42, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
OK, they're all now updated to specify "MP fix" or "queue fix," and my memory was wrong: there were three queue fixes. I'll note though that there are examples where the error was reported to WP:ERRORS before the item hit the main page, but due to the length of discussion or admin response, the error wasn't actually fixed until it hit the main page. So, for example, the Kooraban error was reported on May 5 as a next-but-one error 2 days before going live, but wasn't fixed until May 7 when it was already live. So just because something is an "MP fix" doesn't mean it wasn't caught until it hit the MP, but it does mean the error hit the MP. Just thought I'd mention this wrinkle. Levivich (talk) 14:35, 9 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This seems quite good. I still support efforts to raise standards, especially at the main page, and to use DYK/GA/FA to promote higher standards, but studies have consistently found that most published news articles contain errors.[2] Many of the errors noted above are also somewhat minor rather than outright bogus. Rjjiii (talk) 13:54, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's not just newspapers – see Why Most Published Research Findings Are False. Andrew🐉(talk) 15:33, 10 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Special occasion idea: Olympics[edit]

Discussion on Olympics[edit]

Remembering that we did themed sets for the FIFA Women's World Cup last year, I thought of an idea for a themed set of hooks: the 2024 Summer Olympics take place from July 26 to August 11 this year (in a little over five weeks) and I think there will probably be a decent number of Olympics-related hooks; I at least plan to write a good number of them. I was thinking we might be able to do something like one Olympics hook per day for the duration of the event, similar to how we did for the FIFA World Cup. Thoughts? BeanieFan11 (talk) 20:16, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed. I coordinated something like that for the last Olympics and had been planning on offering that service once more. Schwede66 21:22, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Cool idea! Lightburst (talk) 22:18, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I also like this idea! I know of a couple topics that could provide Olympics-related hooks; I'll look into them. Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 22:58, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've dug out the item that shows how we went about it last time: Wikipedia talk:Did you know/Archive 180#Olympic hooks. Schwede66 22:26, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That looks like work @Schwede66:! Hopefully we can identify a few. Bruxton (talk) 01:04, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It was somewhat involved! Schwede66 01:27, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Some related considerations:

  • Moved to the Olympics: Special occasion holding area.
  • Done – added to the table below.
  • Done – added to the table below.

All the Olympic-related hooks that I could spot are in the table below. Schwede66 03:52, 23 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

My Toby Olubi hook is in prep 3. Feel free to pull if it's of any use to you.--Launchballer 06:58, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Schwede66: I don't know if you saw this, but my Toby Olubi hook is Olympics-related, and could also run near the start of the Olympics.--Launchballer 11:11, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, I didn’t see that. I’ll have a look. Schwede66 13:06, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've pulled it out of Q3 and plugged the hole that I've made. Schwede66 23:36, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Proposal[edit]

The Paris Olympics will be kicking off on 26 July 2024 with an opening ceremony in the early evening. Event competitions start two days earlier on 24 July with association football and rugby sevens. The closing ceremony (article yet to be written!) is on 11 August. That's 19 days of Olympics and as suggested above, we could run Solomon Islands at the 2020 Summer Olympics as a warmup just before that period.

There'll be some special date requests coming in and to avoid filling up individual hook sets with too much sport, I suggest we co-ordinate what will run when to spread things out in a logical fashion. I suspect that we'll stay in a 24-hour cycle for the duration of the event but if that changes, we can accommodate that as well. Time zone–wise, Paris is currently at UTC+02:00 (Central European Summer Time or CEST), hence there are no mental gymnastics necessary as long as we stay in the 24-hour cycle. Comments welcome. Helpers are welcome and essential; I certainly don't want to do this all by myself as this was quite a bit of work some three years ago for the Tokyo Olympics. And with regards to my own special interests, I shall tell you that the Kiwi rowers are in good shape; I can hear the medals clinking already! Schwede66 01:20, 23 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Olympic hooks table[edit]

On the "Approved" page, there is now a heading Olympics: Special occasion holding area.

Article (nom) Requested Suggested date Prep set Notes (all times in CEST) Status
2024 European Athletics Championships – Women's 400 metres hurdles (nom) none 19 July This hook names Femke Bol who is due to compete in Paris. We have a second (double-)hook that names here, hence I suggest we run this as the first warm-up hook to put as much time between the two appearance of Bol as possible. This would lend itself as the picture hook as we've got a good photo. At SOHA
Zali Steggall (nom) none 20 July 1998 Olympic skier Review not yet started
Yang Jingru (speed skater) (nom) none 21 July One of the warm-up hooks; can run on any date before the Olympics start. Under review
René Heyde (nom) none 21 July One of the warm-up hooks; can run on any date before the Olympics start. Review not yet started
Toby Olubi and Can't Touch This (nom) none 22 July One of the warm-up hooks; can run on any date before the Olympics start At SOHA; this double-hook has already had its admin checks done (by Cwmhiraeth)
Liechtenstein at the 1936 Summer Olympics (nom) none 23 July One of the warm-up hooks; can run on any date before the Olympics start Under review
American Samoa at the 2020 Summer Olympics (nom) none 23 July One of the warm-up hooks; can run on any date before the Olympics start
Philippines at the 1924 Summer Olympics (nom) none 24 July One of the warm-up hooks; can run on any date before the opening ceremony; can slide further forward if we get hooks for competitions that start on this date At SOHA
Solomon Islands at the 2020 Summer Olympics (nom) none 25 July One of the warm-up hooks; can run on any date before the opening ceremony; can slide further forward if we get hooks for competitions that start on this date At SOHA
Fathimath Dheema Ali (nom) none 27 July The women's singles prelim round starts on 27 July At SOHA
Evann Girault (nom) none 27 July Girault is going to compete in men's sabre, and that competition is held on 27 July (from elimination to finals; all on one day) Under review
Lilia Cosman (nom) 28 July 28 July Cosman will compete in the qualification round on 28 July. Review not yet started
Alyssa Mendoza (nom) none 30 July Assuming that she is still featherweight, the women's 57 kg boxing competition begins on 30 July with the round of 32. Reviewed
Shachar Sagiv (nom) none 30 July Men's triathlon is scheduled for 30 July starting at 8:00 Under review
Dylan Travis (nom) none 31 July The first USA men's 3x3 game is on 30 July. Subsequent games are on 31 July, 1, 2, and 4 August if that date gets too crowded. At SOHA; this hook has already had its admin checks done (by RoySmith)
2022 European Athletics Championships – Women's 400 metres and 2022 European Athletics Championships – Women's 400 metres hurdles (nom) none 4 August This is the second hook that names Femke Bol. She is due to compete in 400 metres hurdles (heats on 4 August). At SOHA
Emmanuella Atora (nom) none 8 August Atora is due to compete in women's 57 kg taekwondo (assuming that she's still in this weight class). The competition is to be held on 8 August. Under review
Manizha Talash (nom) none 9 August Breaking or breakdancing is a new sport. Who would have known. At SOHA
[[]] (nom)
Note that this should be a subsection within the existing special occasion section, not a separate section. I have adjusted accordingly. I don't understand why the Solomon Islands hook—not shown above but in the section itself—is listed for the day before the Olympics starts; it looks like one that could run any time during the actual Olympics, which the article on the games lists as July 26 through August 11. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:38, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I’ll add it to the table. Things got somewhat crowded last time, hence my thinking of running everything that’s not 2024 Olympics as a warmup beforehand. Schwede66 19:18, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
BlueMoonset, I can see where the confusion arises. As explained above, the Olympic competitions start on 24 July, two days prior to the opening ceremony. Schwede66 04:15, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Schwede66, in that case the lede of the article is wrong. It should be made clear there that while the opening ceremony is on 26 July, the competition itself begins on 24 July. No objection to the Solomon Islands hook running on 25 July if the Olympics themselves have already begun by then; I see no reason why it can't run during the Olympics themselves on a date where there isn't anything more appropriate. I don't think it should be a "warmup" hook, however. BlueMoonset (talk) 03:11, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've put the line "the free encyclopedia that anyone can edit" into action and amended the lead of the 2024 Summer Olympics to spell out that some competitions start on 24 July. I'm easy about running "foo at the YYYY Summer Olympics" during the Olympics if there's room if that's what others prefer; I note we have three four of those hooks. Schwede66 03:41, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

GAN backlog drive in July[edit]

@DYK admins: and other members of the DYK community: WP:GAN is planning a backlog drive for July. This usually results in lots of DYK nominations, which in turn causes us to go into 2-sets-a-day. If able, please reserve some wiki-time for reviewing hooks and prep sets. Thanks! Z1720 (talk) 21:14, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Re "in turn causes us to go into 2-sets-a-day", that does not follow. We would only consider such a step if there are sufficient admins willing to commit to it.  — Amakuru (talk) 22:00, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
just ask the 'crats to give the bit to everyone who promoted a hook in the past month :v – Hilst [talk] 22:25, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Amakuru: Past backlog drives have caused the number of nominations to increase past the 120 threshold. Some editors and admin have used this condition to go to 2 sets a day, even if admin did not indicate that they are committed to it. This notice is to help admin get ready for this possibility. Z1720 (talk) 01:38, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think 2-a-day mode is a bad idea. As a matter of principle, I go on DYK strike when we do that. If other admins want to put in the time to make it work, more power to you, but I won't be. RoySmith (talk) 01:41, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I also see that as more errors, and less time to fix those errors. SL93 (talk) 02:14, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm also an oppose for using 2-a-days as a solution. The burden is too high for those doing the work. It's an unfortunate fact here that those doing the work are vastly outnumbered by those not doing the work, and every solution proposed to move some of that burden onto those not doing the work gets voted down by...wait for it...those not doing the work. Valereee (talk) 12:18, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I also don't like 2-a-day because it can be unfair to contributors in that how their work can get less main page attention than others that run a full day. Narutolovehinata5 (talk · contributions) 07:56, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We should be fine without 12-hour-sets: that is the problem the new nine-hook sets are intended to solve. I don't think that we should go to two/day, but instead just let it even out over time. A little more discrimination in rejecting hooks wouldn't hurt. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 12:25, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
AirshipJungleman29, when 9 hooks a set was proposed you calculated that "10 per day minus pulled hooks should even it out." TSventon (talk) 10:34, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't believe I wrote that TSventon? ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:39, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I did, and I left my workings at Wikipedia talk:Did you know/Archive 196#Hook duration dynamics.--Launchballer 10:41, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Apologies for my confusion AirshipJungleman29 and Launchballer. TSventon (talk) 11:25, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
On the other hand, I think that nine hook sets, with timing out of older, less interesting noms at WP:DYKNA, should work well as a coherent long-term system. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 10:54, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I was initially somewhat skeptical of 9 hooks per set, but it's been working out really well. At this point, I'd even be in favor of 10 hooks per day and encourage people to write shorter hooks. And, yes, not being so adverse to dropping submissions. By the time a nom gets to be 2 months old and is still struggling to get approved, it's time to move on. Even if we do manage to get it up to standard by investing a lot of work in it, by the time it could get published, it's no longer new, which is a a core part of what DYK is all about. RoySmith (talk) 14:51, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
As a promoter I quite like the idea of the opposite RoySmith: going back down to eight-hook sets, and letting the really interesting, stand-out (and definitely error-free) hooks flourish without being surrounded by mediocre ones. The last few preps I've built have been much more enjoyable. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 07:43, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I wouldn't be opposed to that. My main goal is that we never have to run 2 sets a day. If we can get there by being more selective about what we run, I'm all for that, but historically we seem unwilling to do that. RoySmith (talk) 14:52, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Older nominations needing DYK reviewers[edit]

The previous list of older nominations was archived yesterday, so I've created a new list of 37 nominations that need reviewing in the Older nominations section of the Nominations page, covering everything through June 8. We have a total of 258 nominations, of which 89 have been approved, a gap of 169 nominations that has increased by 17 over the past 8 days. Thanks to everyone who reviews these and any other nominations.

More than one month old

Other nominations

Please remember to cross off entries, including the date, as you finish reviewing them (unless you're asking for further review), even if the review was not an approval. Please do not remove them entirely. Many thanks! BlueMoonset (talk) 04:23, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Can I also encourage reviewers to pay attention to the Olympic hooks listed above? The first one that's scheduled (for 19 July) hasn't even had a review started yet, and the queue and prep page reaches as far as 15 July already. Schwede66 04:56, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Prep 4[edit]

1964 New York World's Fair pavilions[edit]

@Hey man im josh, Epicgenius, and Generalissima: I'm not sure how well this will stand up at WP:ERRORS. The true story is more like "built a house out of salvaged material, including some from several 1964 New York World's Fair pavilions", which isn't very hooky. RoySmith (talk) 19:27, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Good point - the house isn't made entirely out of these pavilions. Would this work?
If not, we could use one of the alts. – Epicgenius (talk) 19:31, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
OK, I went with that, but changed "one" to "a". RoySmith (talk) 20:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's a good point, thanks for bringing this up. Luckily there were a number of other good hooks, but I picked that one as it was more quirky and I thought it could work in the quirky slot. Hey man im josh (talk) 19:32, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Way Less Sad[edit]

@Hey man im josh, Koopastar, and Dharmadhyaksha: I don't think this hook doesn't meet WP:DYKINT. Songs sampling other songs are very common, and so I don't see how the hook could be "perceived as unusual or intriguing". Thoughts? ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 20:44, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The band emphasized in the currently sourced interview that the sample was unique to the original's fadeout and barely audible, later building the entire song around that sample. Perhaps better phrasing could be:
This text currently isn't in the article, but if this passes DYKINT then it could definitely be adapted. Koopastar (talk) 00:02, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That is so much better, Koopastar. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 12:58, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Barely audible my sphincter, I can hear it perfectly well on both tracks (and I really don't get the point of fadeouts anyway, just stop playing!). I suggest "... that after Cardi B declined AJR's Way Less Sad and her record label tried to offer it to another rapper, AJR withdrew it and released it themselves?"--Launchballer 13:21, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Prep 5[edit]

Laura Veale[edit]

I think the Laura Veale hook would be easier understood if it specified the town of Harrogate Mach61 07:09, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I disagree. I think context makes clear enough that it's a place.--Launchballer 08:19, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Launchballer My initial thought was that it was a university or hospital of sorts. Mach61 12:03, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Added 'the town of'.--Launchballer 12:15, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"We want the ball and we're going to score!"[edit]

Changed to 'claimed', with the caveat that that is the only part of the hook I have checked, and I'll check the rest later.--Launchballer 12:15, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think "guaranteed" would be a correct interpretation, since it was overtime and a score would win the game (i.e. he's guaranteeing a score – which would mean victory – if he gets the ball). BeanieFan11 (talk) 16:07, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I agree that "guaranteed" works (in the sense of "to assert confidently"), but if that's considered a problem, I think "promised" works much better than "claimed" in this context. DrOrinScrivello (talk) 16:16, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think the verb you're looking for is "boasted". Or maybe "pontificated" :-) RoySmith (talk) 17:01, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, "promised" or "pledged" is less confusing. JoelleJay (talk) 01:36, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I had to make sure of the 2004 overtime rules before comment - the. NFL changes from time to time. In 2004

Article 1 The sudden-death system of determining the winner shall prevail when the score is tied at the end of the regulation playing time of all NFL games. Under this system, the team scoring first during overtime play herein provided for, shall be the winner of the game and the game is automatically ended upon any score (including a safety) or when a score is awarded by the Referee for a palpably unfair act.

So by 2004 rules if his team had scored, they would have won. So it is a win-guarantee of sorts. Same NFL overtime rules applied in 2003. Bruxton (talk) 14:51, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
A guarantee is not just a prediction, it's a promise backed up by an obligation to make the other party whole if you fail to deliver. In conventional use, "I guarantee the power train on this new car you're buying won't fail in the first 10 years, and if it does, I'll replace it for free". That's not what happened here. It was just a boast. There was no "and if we don't, I'll ..." part. RoySmith (talk) 16:18, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I understand your point. In sports a guarantee is different. nothing was offered by the guy who made the most famous win-guarantee: Joe Namath Super_Bowl_III#Namath's_guarantee. You lose and you are embarrassed so you eat crow like Hasselbeck did in this situation. Bruxton (talk) 00:31, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I parse the construction "X guaranteed success for Y", noting the past test, as "guaranteed" being a post hoc descriptor of actions X took that did result in success for Y. I don't read it as describing a potentially failed guarantee made by X prior to the outcome of Y, so it's jarring when that latter sense is used. JoelleJay (talk) 01:49, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It does seem that we are getting too literal. as it is we are replacing a word that works with a synonym for the word. So both work. Lightburst (talk) 15:05, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Prep 3 (week 1 July)[edit]

Beijing Watermelon[edit]

@Rjjiii, Morgan695, and AdJHu: This should be pulled from prep as it lacks a plot summary and lede that summarizes article's key points, contrary to WP:DYKCOMPLETE. Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 21:17, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The plot summary section was titled something different. But the lead is currently just a single sentence. @Morgan695: do you want to try to quickly expand the lead, or pull the article for more time to write? Rjjiii (talk) 22:33, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've expanded the lede to be consistent with articles that meet DYK completeness standards. Morgan695 (talk) 05:00, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Rjjiii: Shouldn't an article about a 34-year-old movie include a longer plot summary? The current one isn't even long enough to be called a synopsis. Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 06:10, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh, gotcha, I can be very literal sometimes. Morgan695, what do you think about expanding the plot summary? The questions that the brief summary raises for me are:
  • What is the nature of the relationship between the grocer and students?
  • Does it tie into any broader cultural themes between the two countries?
  • And do we know what elements are based on historical fact and what elements are fiction?
Rjjiii (talk) 07:22, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I've expanded the plot, though as the film is already something of a meandering slice of life-type story, I don't think it would improve reader comprehension for it to be significantly more detailed than what is currently there. Morgan695 (talk) 15:50, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Morgan695: No, it's too short. WP:FILMPLOT demands a self-contained plot summary with a length of 400–700 words. This shouldn't be an issue if you've seen the movie. Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 18:34, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The MOS does not "demand" anything. If a plot can be adequately summarized in less than 400 words, what's the use in unnecessarily bloating it? If you're so sure it's too short, expand it yourself. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 19:04, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I was just about to retract my comment until yours came up. In any case, the expansion will suffice since I have no discretion here. @Rjjiii: I got no more concerns on my end. Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 19:05, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Nineteen Ninety-Four guy: thanks for the feedback and following up. The article is better for it, Rjjiii (talk) 05:30, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hamad City[edit]

It appears that I have missed a discussion about this nomination and the hook was pulled before it ran. Shouldn't the nomination be reopened since it never ran? Also, I am not really aware of why the hook was not viable. Thanks. Lightburst (talk) 15:00, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, just catching up now. Rather puzzling that Andrew made a point about the hook being wrong by referring to a biased source this publication. This reminds me of the famous quote, "The first casualty in war is the truth". @Amakuru: seemed to indicate that it should be allowed to run again. Hopefully we find a hook which is not sourced or refuted by the Israel Hayom source. Lightburst (talk) 15:33, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
We have more hooks than we can handle, combined with a high error rate. We should be putting less effort into trying to salvage failed nominations, and more effort into making sure the hooks we publish are accurate. RoySmith (talk) 15:38, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That's very harsh. This one was pulled due to a (good faith) error by the reviewers, the nominator having done the right thing during the nomination phase by realising the issues concerned and proposing an alternative hook. It's one thing in the usual case where an inaccurate hook by a nominator slips through, I wouldn't have a re-run for that, but this one I'd just treat like any other hook that was spotted and pulled from the queue or preps, reopen it and move on with our lives. This isn't a regular occurrence certainly.  — Amakuru (talk) 15:42, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think it's harsh. I think our error rate is unacceptably high. RoySmith (talk) 15:48, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
In comparison to what per capita percentage of error rates seen on any other main page spot? I feel "unacceptably high" needs context directly to similar numbers of main page presentations from the other contributing projects (eg per every 500 DYK compared to every 500 FA, 500 ITN, etc). Gut feeling of too much is not reason enough to let a single editor decide for the whole project that other peoples work is not good enough.--Kevmin § 20:33, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The Israel Hayom source comes from the article in question. It appears in a passage which describes extensive fighting for the city long after the airstrike in which it was supposedly "largely destroyed". This inconsistency made it clear that the hook was nonsense. The main culprit is the nominator who wrote the article and so should have been well aware of this from the outset.
If Lightburst doesn't like the source, they should have spotted it and objected when reviewing the article. Note that it was highlighted in the nomination to support the ALT1 hook, which Lightburst reviewed. Checking that the article has reliable sources and is neutral is a standard check. It should be done especially carefully when the topic is contentious.
The article should not be rerun because it has already had over eight hours of invalid exposure on the main page and still seems to be contentious. What ought to be run is a correction, explaining and apologising for the error. How come we never do this when it is commonly considered the mark of a respectable publication? Wikipedia is not a reliable source but we should hold ourselves to a high standard. If DYK published regular corrections then the shame might be a useful check and balance, helping to deter sloppy work.
Andrew🐉(talk) 21:49, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
See #Error rate discussion above for a discussion about corrections/retractions. And, yes, I agree we should do them. RoySmith (talk) 22:19, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I hated to pick on Andrew because he is my friend: please note Andrew, that I did not choose ALT1 as it reads like Israeli propaganda justifying the destruction - and it was sourced to the "occasionally-biased" Hayom. As you know the source is not red on PRS so it is ok to use... when they are not propping up Bibi or whitewashing his war. I am sure Andrew knows that I did check the article, and my checks are never cursory. My hope Andrew, is that you finally start helping with the business of reviewing, promoting and workshopping rather than just throwing stones and telling us we should apologize. I remember Valereee telling you something similar in a thread. Love you Andrew but you have been a regular at errors and you have not been a regular on the reviewer/promotor gnome side. These hooks are reviewed by many regulars and then fussed with by gnomes. It seems you wait and wait and then shout at us through errors. I for one am sorry that I chose the hook that Andrew called out at errors - it certainly could have been workshopped and fixed on the fly. Lightburst (talk) 01:21, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Andrew Davidson! ...shame might be a useful check and balance, helping to deter sloppy work. I can say it is difficult work checking and promoting and there are many moving parts. Our best volunteer promotors often leave or do much much less. SL93, Theleekycauldron, Cielquiparle, vaticidalprophet, were some of our best promotors; since I started, all either scaled back or stopped promoting altogether. I want editors to work with me as they did with the June salamander nomination, if editors shamed me I would not be motivated to volunteer for a job that only gives me a dunce cap as a reward. I am sure Cersei did not like the walk of shame either. :) Bruxton (talk) 02:00, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think the idea of retractions is to shame anybody. I'm sure I've told this story before, but it's a good story, so here goes. In all the best places I've worked, we did post-mortems when things went wrong. Rule number 1 is that the exercise is about improving the process, not assigning blame, and people take that seriously. In the long run, all that really matters is that the team (company, whatever) improves. Shit will still happen, and it will happen to even the best people, so don't get worked up over it.
A humorous variation on that idea is the "designated goat". Before starting a project, pick somebody at random and declare that everything that goes wrong will be their fault. When, inevitably, something does go wrong, you can just blame it on that person, not waste any more time worrying about assigning blame, and get on with fixing the problem. RoySmith (talk) 02:15, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Haha, "designated goat" – love that. I'm happy to be the volunteer DG for the next major stuff up. Throw it at me (I can probably cope; am pretty thick-skinned). Schwede66 02:43, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I just remembered that we also lost Borgqueen. And I really feel the loss of Cielquiparle. Some of our finest editors move on. RoySmith, one place I worked, when there was an unsolvable or hard problem, the boss would say it was a "goat" (in private he would use the full term: "goat f^%$K"). I have had my share of issues working here and I learned from them because editors here picked me up and encouraged me. I like it when the crew is all rowing the boat in the same direction. It gets frustrating at times, but the good outweighs the bad. And Schwede - you will never be our goat! I appreciate you! Bruxton (talk) 02:59, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
"Tobey Maguire got bit by a spider but see, me, it was a goat."--Launchballer 09:05, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think the idea of retractions is to shame anybody: I'd like that if that were the case, since you're right that retractions and corrections don't have to be about shame, but it's hard to read If DYK published regular corrections then the shame might be a useful check any way other than the idea involving people feeling shame. Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 00:21, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

WP:SOHA[edit]

Manizha Talash[edit]

@BeanieFan11 and Sammi Brie: Another "first" hook. If we interpret Afghanistan's first female breakdancer to mean the first woman anywhere in Afghanistan to breakdance, that's clearly unprovable. If this means "first woman to represent Afghanistan in the Olympics as a breakdancer", then it's just a plain easter egg. This is the first year breakdancing is in the Olympics. We could write that hook for every woman breakdancer in this year's competition. RoySmith (talk) 16:12, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I could have been plainer that maybe ALT0 wasn't the best hook, but ALT1/2 are fine. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 16:31, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
ALT2 seems the best to me. RoySmith (talk) 17:02, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

A spoonful of sugar (helps the medicine go down)[edit]

I usually browse DYK every morning. If I spot an error then I take it to WP:ERRORS because that's the process. But also, if I see a hook I like, then I thank the author. For example, today, I quite liked the hook

  • ... that the Wellesbourne, Brighton's lost river, stopped flowing in 1889?

That might not excite others but lost rivers interest me and I even have a book about the lost rivers of London. So, I thanked the author who turned out to be Hassocks5489 – well done! To do this, I had to drill down into the article history which requires some know-how.

And there's an imbalance because error reporting tends to generate public drama while such thanks don't. So perhaps we should surface the thanks to make them more visible and generate more positive feedback. Here's some ideas:

  • As well as counting the views for each article at DYK, also count the number of thanks that they generate. This can be listed both by article and editor.
  • To make thanking easier, provide a link by each hook. When readers click it, it would thank the nominator, set builder and other editors who helped get the hook to the main page.
  • Put a "hook of the day" link into DYK. This would go to a page where readers could vote for the hook that they like best each day. This would mainly be a straight vote but you might record feedback comments too so that editors could say why they like the hook.

Andrew🐉(talk) 10:05, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

If the third option can be done (I suspect it's probably impossible) that would be fantastic. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 12:27, 1 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Did you know nominations/Pure Japanese[edit]

Just a heads up on this nomination of mine, which I would like to be put on hold at WP:SOHA for July 17, having just been approved by a reviewer. The prescribed nomination period shouldn't be an issue, since I nominated it 20 days prior to the occasion date. I thought I'd bring this up because everyone seems to be preoccupied with the Olympics hooks. Thanks, Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 12:03, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I’ve moved it to the SOHA. Schwede66 13:39, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Prep 1[edit]

Interstate 85 in North Carolina[edit]

(nom page: Template:Did you know nominations/Interstate 85 in North Carolina - I swapped this from Queue 2 just now to give more time for discussion)

A couple of queries - firstly, it took me quite a while to even locate in the article where this is referenced. So the text in question is "Past Holly Grove Road on milemarker 96, the northbound lanes cut under the southbound lanes ... the reversed lanes ... the northbound lanes cross above the southbound lanes and return to the normal direction". If we want to say that it "drives on the left" I think we should say that a bit more clearly.

Secondly, I'm not sure the sourcing is adequate for this statement. The cites for the lines in question are links to Google maps, which do indeed show the two lanes crossing twice... but is that sufficient for the above statement about driving on the left, or is this bordering on WP:OR in the absence of sourcing explicitly saying that? I certainly seems interesting, but if 3rd party secondary sources haven't thought to mention it, then I'm not sure we should either. I'd be interested to hear views on that. Pinging @NoobThreePointOh, Daniel Case, JuniperChill, and AirshipJungleman29:  — Amakuru (talk) 13:04, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The question of inappropriate use of maps as a source for this article was brought up earlier and I pushed it under the rug. So now we're back here with the same issue. I think this needs to be pulled. RoySmith (talk) 14:10, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, I just looked at the article and clicked through to the sources. We're not even talking about a map. We're talking about Google Street View, i.e. some photographs taken by the automated camera car. If that's not WP:OR, I don't know what is. This can't stand. RoySmith (talk) 14:13, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Pulled and unpromoted. RoySmith (talk) 14:22, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Amakuru @RoySmith Hold up, I found a proper source from the NCDOT showing a true map of I-85 driving on the left side in Davidson County. I think that should suffice and make it eligible for promotion again. You can go check it if you want as I fixed the sourcing. NoobThreePointOh (talk) 15:04, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Please go discuss it on the nom page and build consensus there. After this getting pulled twice, we need to make sure we get this right this time. RoySmith (talk) 15:14, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Will do. NoobThreePointOh (talk) 15:15, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@RoySmith  Done. I'm just running on pure willpower from revisiting Mario Galaxy 2. Let's hope everyone agrees with my comment. NoobThreePointOh (talk) 15:23, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I would agree with this only insofar as it's not plain-sight evident from the Street View image. Daniel Case (talk) 17:53, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Queue 2[edit]

Edwin Ford Piper[edit]

  • ... that American poet Edwin Ford Piper collected 828 folk songs, most of which were from Iowa and Nebraska?

Quick query, because there's a small wording difference between article and hook. The article says that he recorded 828 songs, in the middle of the paragraph about him collecting from Iowa and Nebraska and all that. But the hook says that he collected 828 songs. IS there a reason for this difference in verb? The implication for me is that he may have collected more songs than that over the years, but that he specifically recorded 828 of those. @SL93, Generalissima, and AirshipJungleman29:  — Amakuru (talk) 13:17, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Amakuru I don't remember why I said "recorded", but it should be "collected". He preserved the songs that he collected per "His most active period of collecting ended with World War I. After the war, he pursued songs only occasionally. By the time of his death in 1939, he had preserved 828 folksongs as well as hundreds of riddles, rhymes, play-party games, folk sayings, and quadrille calls." The hook could also use "preserved" instead of "collected", and I think that is the best option. SL93 (talk) 13:27, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@SL93: cool, thanks. I've amended the hook. Cheers  — Amakuru (talk) 13:34, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Golden Girls (play)[edit]

  • ... that before reading the script for the play Golden Girls, at least nine of the cast members were under the impression that they would be taking the lead role?

The wording for this in the article says "as many of eight of his fellow cast members"... Firstly, this probably should say "as many as eight of his fellow cast members". Secondly, is "as many as" the same as "at least"? I'd have thought the opposite, that this means "up to" rather than "at least".... And finally, this is cited to Branagh's autobiography, which may constitute a primary source and Branagh's perspective on this may not match what an independent observer would say. Not necessarily a show-stopper, but I do wonder if it's appropriate to state this in Wikipedia's voice or not. Opinions on a postcard please. @BennyOnTheLoose, Sammi Brie, and AirshipJungleman29:  — Amakuru (talk) 13:23, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

  • Branagh's quote is "They were all playing the lead, and that made nine of us in total." Happy for suitable rewordings, and, if character limit permits, for this to be attributed (e.g. "...according to Kenneth Branagh...") I hadn't thought using Branagh as a source for this was problematic tbh. Regards, BennyOnTheLoose (talk) 21:39, 3 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Prep 5 (Week 1 July)[edit]

Mindustry[edit]

@JPxG: (the nom) @Sohom Datta: (the promoter) do you want the image in the hook? If so, this can be moved to prep 6. This hook had an image and was promoted to a prep 5 without one. I was the one who reviewed it. JuniperChill (talk) 17:04, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Images are included at the promoter's discretion JuniperChill, seeing as we receive between two and three times as many image hooks as we can fit into sets. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 17:28, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Oh I see. I am new to Wikipedia/DYK so that might be why. I'm fine with not having an image then. JuniperChill (talk) 17:43, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Bulloak jewel[edit]

Hook needs in-text attribution to The Guardian source due to the presence of "arguably". Nineteen Ninety-Four guy (talk) 08:33, 6 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Request for expedited review for an anniversary[edit]

I recently finished developing 2022 Brink's theft and nominated it. I am hoping we can run it in a week, on July 11, the two-year anniversary of the event. I see P2 and P3 are all filled, but couldn't it be possible to bump one of those hooks back? Daniel Case (talk) 17:42, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Daniel Case: I will work on this today. I will review it, so it will need another editor to insert it in the desired prep. Lightburst (talk) 23:03, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
 Done ALT0 is a winner! Human error personified. Lightburst (talk) 23:48, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Giado hook[edit]

Hi @SL93, thanks for promoting Giado to Prep 6! Is there any reason why you chose the synagogue hook? It is definitely compelling (hence my nominating it), but it’s actually not totally unusual for Jewish camps in WWII. The ALT0, about prisoners engaging in trade with free people at the boundary of the camp, is way more unusual, and I am aware of very few camps where this was a reality. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 22:56, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Zanahary I have never heard of either things before, and no one shared a preference. I can change it to the first hook if you want. SL93 (talk) 23:22, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks! To be clear, I wasn’t challenging you, only querying whether you’d be opposed to the first hook :) ꧁Zanahary꧂ 23:24, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I realize that. I will change the hook. SL93 (talk) 23:25, 4 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Zanahary, if you've got a hook preference, it's useful to say so on the nomination. Or provide just one hook and if that's not acceptable for whatever reason, you can always add further hooks later. Schwede66 01:05, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks! I thought I had stated a preference, but I see now I just put my favorite hook first. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 01:12, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Zanahary, it's also acceptable for a nominator or reviewer to strike out a hook. The lets the promoter know you think the hook shouldn't be used. Valereee (talk) 18:48, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Updating nom talk page on image change?[edit]

We've got a bot that updates the nom talk page when a hook is changed after promotion. Would it be possible to make it also notice if the lead image changed? There's currently a bit of contretemps at WP:ERRORS because I failed to ping somebody when I updated an image. If we could automate that, it would be nice :-) RoySmith (talk) 21:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Theleekycauldron:, for obvious reasons. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 21:03, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That bot isn't even currently running, and will probably remain offline for the foreseeable future. So, another good idea for the pile- apologies that I'm only one person :) theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 21:35, 5 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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